Welcome to blind guys chat, where this guy, Oren O'Neill.

Hello.

And this guy, Yan Bloom.

Hello.

Talk about the A to Z of life.

Well, hello, ladies, gentlemen, and welcome to episode 93 of Blind Guys chat. And I want to give a big shout out to my friends in the book club, because later on, we're going to be talking to Bernie Warren and Melanie Pritchard. But I want to, hopefully, my crew in room two are listening to the podcast. That's Harburner, Harry, myself, of course. I'm in that group. Emma and Leanne. And, of course, Megan, our moderator in our class.

Better not have left anyone out there.

Well, there's the other 30 odd book club readers. Well, they're not odd.

Could be. Well, then, one, two, three.

That's an Irishism, meaning 30 and some small number.

Okay.

It doesn't mean they're odd, Óran. This is the Braillists Book Club.

Is the Braillists Book Club. Yeah, this is my group. But there are rooms one, room one, three, four, and five that I haven't mentioned because I don't know everybody in those rooms. But we are going to hear from Bernie and Melanie later on, and it's a great chat with them.

So do someone we know is also in this group, I think is one of those rooms, isn't it, Mr. Stuart? Is he not there?

Well, no, you see, he doesn't grace us with his presence. He's always in the back. Well, he's not always, but he's usually in the back. He's, like, keeping the time.

He's keeping the time.

He's keeping the time. Yeah. And they're always like, oh, Stuart, you're great.

Oh, Stuart, you're brilliant.

Stuart.

Oh, God.

He's only pressing buttons, for God's sake.

But he cannot read Braille. That is also a big.

Writing into.

Us now if we're not careful.

Anyway, I think he's reading it with his eyes.

Well, before we go on, before we go on and talk about the weather, which is kind of changeable, but I have to say, Clodagh and I have been talking about this last weekend because we publish on a Thursday, but we had Paddy's St. Patrick's Day over the weekend on Sunday. And I'm going to use an Irishism, and I'm going to say I have a pain in me hoop.

What does it mean? It's a bit naughty. I like that.

It's your rear end, let's say, actually. Okay, well, then let's look. You don't have a hoop.

I have a hoop.

No, you don't. In Africa, people have also a hoop. Some people do. The people from Cameroon, for example, they agree, but the Nigerians, they are smaller anyway.

Well, okay, so, like the Nigerians, why do you have a pain in me hoop? And I'll tell you why. I've had lots of pain in me hoop about lots of things, mostly about accessibility. But I'll tell you one thing. Claudia and I were doing the shopping, grocery shopping on, I think it was Saturday evening, and we do it online.

Or did you go to do it online?

And we do this thing called.

When he says we were doing it, it's not exactly very accurate. It's a click and collect situation. So I do it online.

Oh, yeah.

And then we go, is this the.

Same that Stuart was called clicking?

This is called click and collect. So Cloda does the ordering online, and then the next day we go and collect it. Right. But the whole point of it is why I've got a pain in me hoop is that I said to Cloda and Larry, you go on into the house. Larry was due his dinner, and I said, you feed Larry, and I'll look after. I'll bring in the groceries, which is great. No problem. No problem doing that whatsoever.

Okay.

Until I started to take out the first bag that had groceries in it, and it's packed in these crappy little plastic, crappy bags.

Oh, yeah, I know.

Hang on, let me finish the story.

Recycle bag.

And it completely bursted.

Too heavy.

And I used some choice words. I was basically bringing in stuff by the armful because I was too afraid of the next bag. What is it? Excuse me, my language. Bloody supermarkets. Who can't use paper bags or proper plastic bags?

Well, I'll tell you, a lot of the supermarkets here anyway, I don't know about with you.

They're the same as. Well.

Yeah, but here, a lot of them don't give you bags at all. They bring things out in kind of these crates, and then you have to bring your own bags, and you pack them there on the ground. Basically, they put the crate on the ground, and you bend over and you pack up all your bags and you throw it in the stuff. And that's okay. Okay, so Tesco, for instance, have that situation. But this was Aldi.

Yeah, the german one.

And I really like them. They're good. They're good value. The food is fresh. They take good care when they're packing it, for the most part. The only thing is they put these. They're basically like crate liner things. So they're quite wide. They throw everything in the crate, and then when you come to collect it, they take the crate out, they tie a knot in the top, and they load it into this kind of weird trolley thing that. Where the crates slide in from the side. But because they're compostable, they aren't strong plastic. A and B, often the knots aren't necessarily the tightest knots. So when you pick one up, if it's heavy, and often, like, they put all the perishable in one and they put all the drinks in another, you can get a really light one. You can get a really heavy one. And, yeah, they have a tire.

I was so annoyed. I was kicking tires. And my neighbor, I could hear my neighbor across the way. I think he was cleaning his car or something, and he stopped. And then I heard footsteps kind of coming. What I thought was in my direction. I thought he was going to help me. But then, because I was using some choice language, I think he's turning.

I don't blame him. I do the same.

That's why I have a painting hoop, and I've also got a painting me hoop about other accessibility stuff going on that I'm getting sick and tired of. But anyway, I won't go into that. Maybe in.

I think we should have Oren's whinge fest section in this show.

Well, yeah, we're talking at the weekend. We should have a new podcast called the.

Groaning constantly.

Yeah.

And we were sick for the last week. Well, probably more than a week, actually, I'd say. And we were feeling a bit miserable, and the pair of us were just sitting there staring into space, just kind of quietly groaning to ourselves.

Larry was watching you guys.

Poor Larry was sadder than ever, and it was all a bit tragic. So we decided, yeah, we should just do a know where we're not actually necessarily talking. We're just kind of groaning. Like that scene when Harry met Sally. You know, that scene where they're.

Yeah, I love that scene. Well, you make it a good couple, then.

We're very sympathic. We're very in sync.

So, anyway, let's move on to, like.

The Muppet show, you know, with those.

Old men that's basically. Warren models his personality.

I was going to talk about.

And Beaker. Beaker is another one of my favorites.

Yeah.

And the great.

I was going to talk about TV later on, but mention a couple of TV programs, but I will mention one that doesn't have. No. It doesn't have audio description. It's on Netflix and Floda loves it because it reminds her of me. And it's called louder milk. And it's about this guy who is an alcoholic, and he's holding these AA meetings in a church. And Floda thinks he's exactly me.

He's basically cantankerous and cranky and does nothing but give out all the time. And I quite like him. And Oren has this thing where he loves cranky men on television. So if it's a film or a TV show and it has a cranky man in it, Oren is going to love it.

I don't know why I'm on TV corner, but there's another guy called Eugene.

Levy.

And what's his thing called? The reluctant Traveler. It's on Apple TV. His thing is he says he likes a good foyer. It doesn't necessarily go outside. So in these episodes, these series are trying to get him outside and get him to do things. And he's kind of a little bit. Oh, really? You want me to go on a jet ski? Yeah, right. Okay. I don't really want to do that. Yeah. And that's kind of me. I'll just sit here on the beach.

But he's actually a little bit more kind of pleasant, though. Whereas you're just.

Yeah, he likes actually going on the jet ski.

Well, he's giving it a go. But then again, the only reason I think he's giving it a go is because Apple are probably paying him a fortune to do, say, in normal circumstances, if he was on a beach and somebody said, hey, do you want to go on a Jessica? He would say no. Beside him going, good man, Eugene. You stay where you are.

That is good. But I have got also the system with this collect. You have click and collect, but we got a click and then drop at your doorstep.

Oh, yeah, but you have to pay for that. And I'm too tight.

Well, they say it's free of charge, but when you are above 35 euro for a drop.

35 euro plus the food, plus the groceries.

No.

If I spend more. So if you have less. But when we do it once a week, then you have a little bit, approximately 70, 80 euro or something with the daily things, and then it's for free.

But we are also in bags.

Yeah, from two meter. And then you need to catch it.

The eggs.

One at a time. Yeah, the eggs and then the bottles, et cetera. That's not so nice. No, but they come with an electric car and then those little, like the tuktuk in India, those little cars they have, but they are quite narrow and they're quite high. So in the beginning, when they were not experienced drivers, they were falling sometimes in the corner.

And everyone's groceries was falling.

Exactly. And also they're quite sensitive for the wind.

If that was in Dublin, all the little nerdy wells would be out taking.

Everything away from those. It never survived.

Claudia tried to get a delivery the other day by drone.

There's a new service here in Dublin, and it's a food delivery. Sorry, Larry is poking at me because. Yes, I know. I love you. I do love you. I have to keep rubbing him because. And if I stop, then it's called mana. M a n a, as in mana, mana.

Oh, yeah.

It's a drone delivery service now. It's only in beta at the moment. They're testing it at the moment. And I've signed up for their beta program, but they haven't accepted my application yet.

Please keep us posted. Would be nice. What kind of food do you then? Pizza.

The idea is they do deals with local coffee shops and local takeaways and things like that, and so they can deliver things up to the size of about a shopping basket. So not a trolley, but a basket that kind of size. They fly at 200 meters and then they come down to about 50 meters, and then they drop it with a little cable, slowly. So you have to arrange to meet them and you unhook it, I presume, and then off they go again.

And then you get your coffee or your pizza or whatever, and you stick it in the microwave because it's freezing.

Yeah, that's true.

I saw it in the air over hovering over a house there. I don't know, it's about a week and a half ago now. I saw it and I just thought, wow, that's like, it looked extraordinary. And I could see the little cable coming out.

How's it going to work?

I was just going to say, how's.

That going to work?

I don't know.

Do bb a little bit.

Maybe they.

Give you a little like a PlayStation.

Game controller and you can. Game controller? Wow, man. Yeah. Fortnite. Hey, you can shoot it. Then Tico will be our game. Oh, my God.

Training and everything. Yeah, you love it.

Anyway, there you go. So hopefully, hopefully we'll get to test it out and see what that's like.

Will we hear from our guests?

Yeah, you can email [email protected] or tweet us at blindguyschat if you've any comments or questions.

Now here on radio five. We've got time for two guests, two wonderful guests, ladies and gentlemen. Apologies for my throat. We do have two very well known ladies here from the UK. You will know these women, Bernie Warren and Melanie Pritchard from the Iceland accord, because these were the two women that negotiated the truce between the polar bears and the penguins on that famous island, Skunk island, where there was that infamous fight between the penguins and the polar bears. And the penguins were throwing fish, of course, at the polar bears. And as we all know, polar bears don't eat fish. Climate change. Yeah, they're just like burgers. So well done, Bernie and Melanie, for agreeing for. And as well as that, you're also, as a side job, Bernie is responsible for me joining the Braillist book club and we want to talk about all about that. And, Melanie, you were looking after Braille for beginners course. And I have it on good authority from a good friend of ours, Jan, that Melanie is a very kind and very wonderful teacher of braille.

Oh, that's wonderful. Because we love Braille in our. We do.

Yeah.

So welcome, ladies, welcome. Very well. And I like the intro and it's really good a scene now. So with the climate change that the polar beers, they need to adapt to this. Yeah, they got to adapt to the McDonald's. It's really something. What kind of books do you read, Melanie and Bernie, in the book club, because Oren told me already a little bit, because he is talking about it all over in the shows. Perhaps you heard it about. But now it's good to have you here for fact checking.

Oh, bless. Yes. In the book club, basically, we've always sort of. Mostly, I say most of the time, yeah, we read children's books purely nothing.

To do with the fact that I'm a child.

We're all children at heart.

Sleeping time, probably, actually for three reasons.

One, they're generally not offensive. Secondly, that they're generally quite short. And thirdly, it sometimes gives an opportunity for us to read a book or have a really good excuse to read a book we've always wanted to read. I've never got around to reading, so, yeah, that's it, really.

We have another little reason as well.

For the book club.

Quite often when people start to read in front of other people, they get quite nervous. So if you've got something that gives you a bit of a smile and makes you relax a little bit, we read in our beginners group once. We read Paddington and we had such a laugh. Yeah, we did. And I liked it so much that I think I read it with two groups. I read it again. So it just relaxes people, makes them feel comfortable, they get to know each other, they have a little laugh because we just want them to enjoy reading. That's what it's all about.

How did it all come about, Bernie? Because you're the one who's responsible for this.

Really aren't.

So before COVID I used to go to learn braille in a class near me. And even starting braille was by accident because I was learning computer skills. And then one week there wasn't anyone in this class to read to do computer skills. So basically I started to learn braille and wow, I was hooked by the first week. But then COVID came along a few years later and I so missed reading other people, which is what we do once a week. So I literally put on Facebook and know, is there a reading group or something like that on Facebook? And at the same time I put that on. I had wanted an orbit 20 brow reader and I couldn't afford one. So basically at the same time I was doing a sponsored walk around my garden, my back and front garden, to raise money for an orbit. And the reason back and front garden is because I had to shield because of COVID And I raised the money really quickly. Within 4 hours, I'd got my 500 pounds and it was amazing. So I got the money and then I thought, I wonder if we could read. Like maybe there's an orbit reading group or something like that. So that's what exactly what I put on the 25 August 2020 on the Facebook. And straight away, Dave Williams from the Braille foundation came back straight away and.

Said, yeah, let's start one.

And so we started one.

We started on the 3 September 2020.

And with five of us, a really small group. And then quickly people wanted to join.

But they were like, oh my gosh.

Shane read so much quicker than us and we couldn't read at that because we're like five of us were learning braille. And so basically, long story short, we decided to add another group. And then Mel, who's been fantastic with her braille for Beginners course, which is brilliant, and I actually did that course a couple of years ago, decided then to join in with beginners as well. So it's grown really. And now we've got five different reading rooms.

So you're very new to Braille then.

Yeah.

So my cytok started in 2011 because I've got diabetes and I've got diabetic macroedema and I've got glaucoma and cataracts.

So I was visual impairment.

Oh, sorry, yeah, I know I'm a bit greedy as far as I could. I did quite a few books. It's quite good for medical students, actually. They basically say, you haven't got this as well, have you? And I turn up to another one of their ground rounds. Anyway, 2011, I started having to have treatment for that and I was registered site impaired in 2016.

And Mel, where do you fit in the picture of have you been blind all your life?

I have to say, I can go back to being blind in the 60s.

Because absolutely forever were the days, my dear. Exactly.

I don't think of myself as having sight loss because you can't lose what you've never had and I've never had it. So there we go. That's my take on it.

May I ask you then, because we are running always. I think it's a nice follow up on the previous edition. Oren, do people dream when they are non sighted or not by birth?

Do you dream to this one? Yeah.

Or you listen to it? We have a listener, we meet one.

I thought I'd better find out what it's all about before I come on.

How do we have to behave?

What do we have to say? I dream in the amount I can see now. When I was younger, I dreamt my dreams were blind because I couldn't see anything when I was younger. But I have got a bit of sight now, so I think you just dream with whatever your memories and your day to day activities are, they just reflect in your dreams. That's my take on it.

So sorry, can I just come back? And that says the guy with no voice. Did you say you had more or less no sight when you were younger but now you have some sight?

Yeah, well, when I was younger they thought I had a condition that I hadn't got. And so my parents were just told, oh, she's never going to be able to see, there's no need for. They kept saying, she seems to be able to see a little bit. No, she can't. So they just encouraged me not to use my vision because in the day I'd got no glasses or anything to cut out the light. I have a very light sensitive condition.

Okay.

So I just technically couldn't see. And then I think I was rediagnosed in my thirty s and I won't make a long story of it, but it was amazing because a guy eventually took an interest in my eye condition and he put me forward for rediagnosis. But the actual day, when they put a lens up in front of my eyes, and I went with my husband out into a car park, they said, just go away with this lens for a minute and see how you feel about it and come back to us and see what you think. This ophthalmologist, whatever, I don't know what he was, but he was really excited about it. We went into this car park, and I stood and my husband said, right, okay, without the lens, what can you see? And I said, well, not a lot, really. I can see there's a car there and not much else beyond it. And I put this lens up to my eye and I kind of went, oh, there's something at the end. It could be a building, and there's little something or others. They could be windows in the building. And my husband just grabbed hold of me and wheeled me round and marched me back into this optician, whatever he was, and said, we want this. Whatever it is, whatever it costs. We don't need any more time to look at it. We want it now.

Wow.

So, yeah, it was a huge.

Are you still married also now, you see, wonderful, wonderful.

Cost him that much, you see. And just seeing things like the pattern on my. I had a young child at the time. I walked into his bedroom, like, what have you done to your carpet? What's all this on your carpet? And he's like, mum, that's a pattern. It's quite exciting to suddenly get that.

I'd say so, yeah.

And did you gain more then afterwards, or was improving with the lenses quality?

Have you got x ray vision?

Those kind of really dodgy looking red glasses that I started wearing, then became another optician said, we could put that in a contact lens and that would look a little bit less freaky. And, of course, the advantage of contact lenses is I didn't get any light going around the edges like you do with glasses, so they were even more effective. So I suppose I feel as if I have more vision, but it's probably just that my brain is getting used to that amount of vision and making more of it.

Presumably you had started to learn braille as a.

Yes, yes.

And then where did the brailleists come in? Where did the association with the braille's foundation come in?

And Bernie, I think that was during lockdown. I'd been a braille tutor. I worked for Coventry city council as a braille tutor. And when I started teaching braille, I very, very soon realized that I wasn't a good braille teacher at all. I don't know who said I was a kind braille teacher. I'm going to treasure that comment. I soon realized that I couldn't teach brow very well because I just assumed everybody could feel. And I had all these people losing their vision, and I was giving them this brain and they just couldn't feel it. I'm like, what are they like? Why can't they see it?

You were rubbing their fingers over the doctor.

Brutal.

They are. They can't feel the brow because it didn't occur to me, because I'd always been able to feel the brow because I'd always had no vision. So I then had to kind of go back to the drawing board and think, hey, I've got to help these people. So now our braille for beginners course does concentrate quite heavily on learning how to use your fingers effectively and feel the. You know, people just want to learn all the letters and the short forms and everything else. If they can't feel, it's going to be no use to them.

Also, a beginner's question. We had it with Mo Oren also recently. He is also beginner. How do you learn or teach then? If you have a book with multiple lines on one page, to don't miss the line, and to read nicely, continuously, from line to line, downwards.

Right. How do you teach it?

Well.

This is for the car, Melanie.

So just this is not a test. Don't put the pressure too much.

Marks out of ten.

Exactly.

When Bernie did her class and she was with a teacher and whatever, and you're in a room with someone, you can just make sure their fingers are doing what they should be doing. When it gets difficult is when you're on Zoom and you're just having to kind of assume that people are doing what you're telling, what you tell them to do, and putting their hands on the page and moving across nice and straight, and keeping their fingers nice and straight and not moving them up and down, as well as from side to side. And you just have to trust that they're doing what you ask them to do. And that's really difficult. That was my big thing when the braillists came to me and said, we want to do this brow for beginners over Zoom. And when I thought about it, how am I going to do that? Because you're not with someone. So it's just really trying to make those lessons verbalize everything. If that is probably not a very good word, but make it really clear verbally so that they know what they're doing and that's what we've done with the recordings on the braille for beginners. We've tried to really make it clear so people can have the resources in front of them, listen to the recordings and move along.

Yeah, I'd love to hear that, because it's one issue I'm still finding, particularly with. So I'm reading, as you know, Yan and the ladies know, Mary Poppins.

Oh, Mary Poppins, yeah.

Which is a film I've never seen when I could see, and it's a story I didn't really know. But I have it on the braille display, on the focus. But I also got from the RNIB the actual hard copy, and I find it a little bit harder to read on the hard copy because I'm probably not doing the right movements or moving too much with my finger on the hard copy. So, yeah, I'd love to be able to listen to those recordings. Bernie, is the book club, as far as you know, is it the only book club, Braille Book club, certainly in Europe, would you say in the world? Or do you know other book club, book clubs around the world?

I personally don't know of any whereby you actually meet, like, on Zoom, and then you read altogether. It's about reading. It's not about talking about your book so much, although we do have a little talk about what's going on. I don't know if there's any other book clubs where you're primarily there to read the book with other people. And that's why I wanted to start it, because I didn't know of any others. I mean, I know we have people from America joining us and over Europe joining us, and the moderators know farm wide. I mean, we even have a moderator from New Zealand who joined very early morning. Really, I'm stunned at how many people want to give their time to help us. But interesting enough, when I learnt braille, first of all, by sight, but very close up, so very, the books were 5 cm from my face because I have some useful vision at that distance. I didn't think I'd be able to learn it by touch. And then during lockdown, I thought, come on, come on, Bernie, have a go. Just see if you can learn by touch, because I've got diabetes and pricking your fingers and all that, I didn't.

Think I could do it.

So what I did was I borrowed a book from the R I B, a book I already knew in Braille. And then I read this book. It was just a short story, a short story. And that got me going and thinking, yes, I can do it by touch, where I rethought I would never be.

Able to do that.

So I've really enjoyed going from sight to touch because it just has stretched my mind. And obviously on a Friday, which is when I help other people to learn braille. Now, the Lego bricks have been revolutionary.

In our.

Big ones. Yes.

And I love also, so we've got adults learning braille using the Lego bricks, and not just for children. And they've been absolutely brilliant. We've had such fun with the Lego bricks. So I'm a massive fan of braille. I'm looking forward to Braille 200 this year. And in January we had the braille day. I put loads of information on LinkedIn about it.

You really want to spread the gospel of braille. That's what I learned.

I love it. I love it. Stretches my mind and it's like in a lift. I tell lots of students that I'm with about how you read the brell in a lift and what the numeral indicator means and all that. And on prescriptions, it's really important for people to read Brell on the boxes.

And that, if I may ask, do you prefer reading on a book or from digital braille display?

So on a braille display, I think both are important, but it's easier, I think, on a braille display because you've only got one line of writing at a time and the dots are plastic and really they're very hard to touch. They won't get squashed with you trying to press down. If you know what, think in a way that's easier, but learning, think, you know, is a really good skill.

Mel, what's your preference?

Yeah, for pleasure reading. I still quite like to have an old fashioned, just ordinary book. Yeah. But in reality, more often than not, I'm reading from a brow display and writing using a brow display because it's just easier and more compact to carry about whatever else. So, yeah, I'm happy with either, really.

I know, like, we have the canute, the braille display, which is multi line braille display, but I've tried one of them. Are you in favor of maybe braille moving from braille displays, maybe like the orbit moving from single line to maybe double line to multiline?

I think there is a real place for something like the know in the classroom setting for doing something like maths or braille music or something where you really need to be able to use more than one line at a time. I think they're great for that, for personal use. I borrowed one and had a look at it and had great fun with it, but I would never have bought one because it was so big and I would never have carried it.

Yeah, that's what I'm thinking.

It's like a lot of things. Depends on the situation, isn't it, really? Yeah. It's a brilliant gadget.

If you have more than one line, that might also help you reading books, because obviously books have got single line spacing and that sort of thing. So going from digital to a book might be easier because you're used to already tracking for the next line, whereas you don't get that on a single.

Line, like a little bit.

I felt it also very much more relaxed to sit with a book on your laps or even to read in your bed. And then because with a braille display, it feels always so awkward. You have always the battery whatever. And above it is still digital. And with a book that is really, when it's evening time or whatever, then you can sit down and that is really comfortable in.

The funny thing with Cloda, my wife, is that she now doesn't think I can actually. I read the book at night sometimes when we're watching, you don't need light. And Cloda says there's no way you could be reading the braille and watching TV at the same time just before we finish up. So how do people get information about the braille? Okay, you've allowed me in, a guy from Dublin. You have some Americans in the group. Is anybody welcome from any country?

Anybody's welcome? Absolutely. And for a one stop shop, really, the main website, www.braylists.org, is the main website. And from there you have so many options because you can look through the podcasts. We have various activities.

You have also podcast club.

We do.

Brailleists have a podcast. It's not as good as blind guys chat. We've got two listings.

Yeah, we do get a cruise. We do have our master classes that we run, and they are put into podcasts so that people can go back and think, oh, like for the reading or a new thing about tactile reading. And there's a really good podcast on our feed that Sean actually did. Chantel did it about tactile reading. And she goes through all these little hints and tips and tricks.

Oh, great.

So there's those, the book club registration, all that kind of thing is all on the website. There's a newsletter that comes out every week. So there's lots of ways to keep up with what the Braillisters are doing. And, yeah, we have people from various different countries and we just welcome anyone who is keen on Braille. I think the mission statement is something really sort of basic and straightforward, like more braille, because we just want to see more braille, want to encourage more people to use it, even if it's just at a really basic level. Like the beginner's course just does the Alphabet and numbers and punctuation and if that just gives them a start. And because we've used a very similar method to the fingerprint reading and writing braille course, if people get to the end of the beginner's course and they want to further it, they can just buy fingerprint and carry on with grade two. So we're giving them all those options. Ww dot braillifts.org can you set up.

A preference as well to who is in the room? In same room? Because if I join, I would not go.

If you don't want to be with me. That's what you're saying, isn't it?

No, Stuart. Sorry, Stuart. Bernie, I like to be.

Problem with Stuart is Stuart runs a very tight clock. We're done at five to seven and that's it.

Definitely.

I have to say, if I can answer that question to a certain extent, this is why I think it's so welcoming. You fill out a little form to begin with to put in your application to join the group. And one of the questions is where do you think you are on braille in terms of reading or speed or what grade or whatever? But ultimately, if I'm correct, ladies, the choice is up to the reader what room they wanted to join because there's five rooms. I think I'm in low babies still because I'm in room two.

They used to be named.

Actually, they did.

The rooms used to be names, but then it got a little bit complicated when we added in a fifth they want to have. So Mel leads room one and I lead room four.

Yeah, and then you get really sickened when you hear Terry, who's from America, and she leads room five and you hear her say, yeah, we read chapter eight this evening. We're going to read chapter and we're like, we're not even halfway down the page. Yeah, absolutely. But it's very welcoming and I know I bang on about it and I have been for the last while. Jan is getting a bit sick of me talking about it, but it's really a most inclusive, wonderful, wonderful club. And both of you should be very proud of what you've done. It really is fantastic.

Thank you very much for having all these nice talks about braille because Braille is really. Yeah, we are a big fan of braille and we love that everyone. Well, we like also to spread the gospel of Braille, and that's really. Braille is not dead. It's alive.

Absolutely not dead.

Definitely not. Well, thank you for having us. Thank you.

Yeah. Thank you.

Hold on. Many thanks.

I have to apologize, ladies and gentlemen, because when I recorded that last week, I did have rather a bad case.

What happened?

Well, I had Larry Jitis. Larry Gitis.

I hope the shipline was quite good to keep it away from me.

We were both sick, actually, so it was kind of a bit of a miserable household there for a while.

It was a bit, yeah. But thanks to Bernie and Mel. And I really hope that we will put the link in the show notes as we have more or less. I've done it for the last three or four episodes, but it's really a great little group of people that are in the book club, and I can't but recommend it. So please, if you're thinking about if you do read braille, even at no matter what level, have a think about joining it and it'll be a good crack for you.

It sounds like such a good idea. I have to say, we were chatting with our braille teacher, Jan there during the week, Audrey Tormy, who taught us how to read Braille. And we were telling her, she was very impressed that Oren is in a braille book club.

Yeah, she proud. I'm proud.

She thought I'd given it up.

Oh, really? Oh, you are very good then.

Hey, bonus points for Oren.

We were talking about TV Corner earlier on. The other one I'm going to mention is on Netflix. New one that we only saw the first episode last night is called the Gentleman. I actually like that one.

You know, the daylight is getting longer and now you can do something. Yeah, no, I think not so much TV, because you can do something in the evening again as well.

But I do want to talk to you, Jan, because you were talking about something off air in between shows. You seem to be obsessed with the.

Sing it first, then. I should have asked Rosalie to be honest, but it's really. It is bad noise. My God, it's terrible. But it is shocking. But it is really a guy. Well, I was not familiar with him and I forgot his name already. I'm well prepared. Sorry. Yeah, but you throw me for the bus now. But that's really. Now I know how it feels.

Good authority that from a avid Eurovision lover. That'll be Kevin. Kevin has already been invited. I think at the end of March he'll know all the songs for all the country. And he reckons that the song is in with a chance. Possibly, but Italy and I cannot now remember what the other. He said. Ukraine has a good song. Italy and somebody else. But the Netherlands have a good song.

But we don't want to win it, to be honest, because. No, exactly. Then all the customs or your taxes are going up again. Come on. That's what we don't want.

Is your guy juiced Klein? Is that his?

He has done already in the past a lot of shows. So he is used to these big crowds in a way. And he is really able to make a big party. He cannot sing in a way. He looks striking.

He's got really blonde hair and mustache and really pointy shoulder pads that go up to kind of mid ear level.

Yeah, it's a funny guy, but he's also europappa. So it's a euro daddy in a way. You know what it's called? Euro daddy.

Sounds like fun.

It is.

Listen to what Kevin has to say in a few weeks time.

Because we had more than 2 million streams or something after one day already. Yeah, but Ukraine and then Italy, they have also.

The other country, Finland. Maybe it's Finland, but I'm not sure.

But who knows?

Ukraine he thinks is good. And Italy. But there is one other that's in. I don't think it's France. Why do I think it's France? But it's not France? He's probably listening to the podcast now going, I told you.

Yelling at Denmark.

What are you told? Or Sweden again he says, Sweden.

Not a chance.

No, really.

He was watching whatever they call it, their kind of national song.

Yeah.

And he says, no, the song that Sweden have picked this year. Clearly they don't want to win.

I can understand know Marcus and Martinez.

They have two young on to.

Let's go on to what have we got clothing.

Oh, God. Yeah, we have a few, actually. We have a lovely audio message from our friend Mo.

Hello, blind guys.

Let me just.

Hey, get out from underneath that bus that you threw me on. Bus one moment and I'm up again.

Sorry.

You guys really ought to stop that. Half the bus drivers in Ireland and the Netherlands are traumatized. I was in a bus once and just started sobbing and shaking violently and.

He had to pull the bus over.

I just asked him, what's wrong? And he said, I was driving the bus. Take a guy doc and there was these two flying apparitions. They had something like what? You had your cane, both of them. And they had their canes crossed and they flew over my bus. And then they pulled their canes away and they just dropped a poor sod right underneath my bus. With your zip line. Flying over buses, throwing people under them. You really ought to stop it.

It's really just like getting Ross.

Claudia and I will have to step in. We'll have to be the adults in the room and take away your zip lines. We'll just cut them. It's starting to become an epidemic.

Cut them while you're.

Okay, all right?

We're the adults.

The reason why I had to get out from underneath this bus then, yes, I was at the Fs cast. I was actually.

Yeah, you see?

He admits.

Just stop what you're listening to right now and go listen to the Fs cast. I mean, you've been listening to the blind guys for years and years and years now. But there are other podcasts out because you're loyal to the blind guys. I know that. But still, there are other things that you can listen to as well.

No.

And I'll be back at the blind guys, too.

Euro Papa. Hey, Europapa.

If not, I'll take away their zip lines. Don't worry.

At any rate, he's quite rude at this.

Know, since I joined your show, I gotten a whole lot more dates. And these women are pretty know. They keep on asking me about Oren's wives.

Oh, really?

And they keep on asking me like, how do they look? Do they seem happy? Not their wives, but Yan and Oren. They're going on dates with me, but I keep on asking about the other. I don't know what's going on there, but I'll take what I can get. I'm happy to go on those dates and talk all about you guys.

That's all I do now.

So thanks for that. At least I have more dates. Look at it from.

But it's Ramadan, so he's out of dating. Well, folks, come on. No.

Well, that bus driver is really upset again. Okay, I need to take care of this.

Bye bye bye.

Okay, he can bring them to the cinema. He just. No popcorn.

Yeah.

He can't buy her popcorn.

Well, he can buy her popcorn. He just can't have any.

She's going to think he's a lousy date. Like, you know.

No, but at least it's good to hear that. But we want to have numbers, reports of those dates. Of course.

Check in with Mo. How's the love life going, Mo?

Exactly.

Checking new segment.

I like that.

Mo's dating life.

Romance moments.

Yeah.

Anyway, have we got any? Was it just Mo?

No. Thanks, Mo, for that. That was the only audio message this great.

Time for one more.

Only one. Okay, well, I'll save the others then. I'll do this one from Gary Hoff.

Like cough hello, Gary. Hey.

He says hi, guys. First of all, I'm so sorry I've been so quiet. Things have just been very hectic. I had to binge listen to catch up on the pod and other pods as well. What do you mean, other pods, Gary?

Yeah, listening to other pods.

Drop them.

Monopoly. We have gone.

Exactly. Still enjoying BGC so much. Pity about Stuart, but I've been enjoying the guest hosts, who's the new voice artist for the intro of the show now. Very well noticed, Gary. Oren, do you want to talk about that?

That's the lovely Clara Murray, one of my audio describers.

She's doing nice.

We love Clara.

She's fantastic.

And it's nice to be able to know to announce who our guest hosts are. And we didn't have one unless you're going to list me as a guest host, are you? But anyway, Gary goes on, weather has been lovely. We're going into autumn now, or as they say, fall. We had days of 35 degrees Celsius, which I love, Gary says, but it's cooling down a bit now. How are chef and Larry doing? Last time Jan said chef had an operation. I hope that's all better now. Jan, how's chef doing?

Yeah, he is actually very well, Claudia. I can say he is getting well. He is the old chef again. Stubborn, but really obeying. I must really give him all kind of well. I don't know what's happening, to be honest. It's funny. And his nail was cut off, that's what was. But it's growing already. I think it's almost 1 cm already.

Wow, that's amazing. I'm so glad he's okay. So I'm glad to hear that.

That's great.

And Gary, by the way, I will.

Do a picture smart description of a picture of chef because Jaws is now using Gemini. Yeah. And it's really that also emotions are being explained. Yeah, described.

If they were to describe Larry, they'd say a very sad looking yellow Labrador.

Really?

He's got this droopy eye thing that.

Makes him look really sad.

He's the happiest doggie.

Oh, you should try with pictures.

Yeah, I will, actually.

I actually think he wants to go out now, so we should probably, sorry, Gary.

That's Gary.

You guys must look after yourselves and keep up the good work. Regards, Gary.

Thank you, Gary.

And Gary, just a little bit of sports news for you. Ireland won the Six nations last weekend. Harsh, harsh, harsh, harsh. Well, yeah, that's all we've got time for because we yap a lot on this show. If you're listening for the first time, we do yap a lot. And we have fun, though.

Yeah, for sure.

Which is good. So we do have to go now, ladies and gentlemen. But so we will see you in two weeks time. And don't forget to email us at [email protected]. If you would please send us an audio message or send us just an email text. And please do tell your friends, if you like the show, do tell your friends and ask them to subscribe as well.

Please check me.

Bye bye.

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